tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17534827.post785447953510148013..comments2024-03-27T22:02:52.479-04:00Comments on Digital ProTalk: Perfectly Perfect Exposure - It's All In the Hands; and Food For Your BrainDavid Ziserhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02674227631785266632noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17534827.post-58523068906919306312010-05-08T16:35:30.614-04:002010-05-08T16:35:30.614-04:00Hi David!
Wanted to drop a few lines.
First of a...Hi David!<br /><br />Wanted to drop a few lines.<br /><br />First of all a really huge thanks for the excellent work and articles on your blog. Everytime extremely inspiring. Even for one beeing in the business for a few years there is always something new and interesting. Thanks!<br /><br />Just read your post and thought this must be spread to the german speaking community (since im originally german but working as a journalist and fotografer nearby the polar circle in Swedish-Lapland though im blogging mostly in german).<br /><br />So i decided to take up the information and wrote a blogpost about it here:<br /><br />http://www.lapplandblog.eu/files/9d3ae066fd70913fc6be37b3dbbe608f-1175.php<br /><br />Of course i named you as the "origin" and set two links to you. Hope that helps you getting more traffic and business :)<br /><br />Best regards from the polar circle<br /><br />HenningHenning Wusthttp://www.lapplandblog.eunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17534827.post-68491363562045305512010-05-06T13:59:53.335-04:002010-05-06T13:59:53.335-04:00David,
I couldn't agree more about the LBRB to...David,<br />I couldn't agree more about the LBRB tour. I attended last week in Michigan. I recommend it quite highly. Thanks for another great post.<br /><br />NickNickhttp://www.nickedwin.com/blognoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17534827.post-73774433016059117322010-05-06T08:29:31.981-04:002010-05-06T08:29:31.981-04:00Hi Gary,
A couple of things. First, could you ela...Hi Gary,<br /><br />A couple of things. First, could you elaborate more about what you mean regarding underexposing? Our articles’ focus was on getting *correct* exposure so sincere apologies if anything I personally said inadvertently implied otherwise, that would be useful to know, and your insights would be helpful to other readers, that is a good very article you're recommending.<br /><br />As far as the consequences of underexposure and the first stop holding half the information, what that article you’re referring to is saying is basically true, at least conceptually. But it turns out that *correct* exposure is still critical, whether in the highlights or in the shadows.<br /><br />There are some good articles out there sharing that correct exposure is important (or even critical) even in our digital age, but understanding why correct exposure is still important involves a key technical nuance that I’ve never read in the articles I’ve seen that discuss this, nor in forum discussions I’ve been involved in on this topic.<br /><br />In theory, yes, the first stop contains half the digital information. That is based on binary arithmetic where, for instance, in the 4-digit binary number 1101 each digit to the left controls twice the numeric range of the digit to its right. So the rightmost digit controls two possible values (0 and 1), the digit to its left controls 4 possible values (00, 01, 10, 11) and so on. A 4-digit binary number has 16 possible values so if its leftmost digit is 1, that controls 8 of those value and if it’s 0 then that controls the other 8 values. <br /><br />So the leftmost digit controls half of the total information of the entire binary number. In theory the same goes for F-stops in a digital file. A digital file is basically one very huge binary number (a large group of them, actually, but for our purposes seeing it as one very large number will do just fine).<br /><br />That is the theory. <br /><br />In practice, however, the instant we press the shutter, every single binary digit in that file becomes permanently fixed in the sensor and written permanently into a file. Not one of those binary values can be changed. Any changes to the values of that file then have to be done through interpolation, and interpolation always loses information and fidelity. <br /><br />Because highlight information is stored in the leftmost bits (see above), the highlight information stored there can access a wider range of possible values than the shadow information stored in the rightmost bits can access. Manufacturers also devote more bits to storing the highlight information if I recall correctly. Between those two, there are more nuances available for highlight values than for shadow values. Thus there is more leeway.<br /><br />That said, interpolation is inherently lossy and has its limits. If we follow the ETTR (Expose To The Right) histogram philosophy and by doing so end up overexposing the image, be it in highlights, middle tones or shadows, it can be hard or impossible to recover those values, certainly not with the depth, detail and richness we’d get with correct exposure. David discusses this in his Master Class, which is yet another reason to take advantage of the opportunity to study with him, his Master Class is an exceptionally valuable resource that we’re very blessed to have made available to us.Robert Ashhttp://www.robertash.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17534827.post-56920826025710419942010-05-06T08:20:22.512-04:002010-05-06T08:20:22.512-04:00Hi Scott, Greg,
You both bring up important point...Hi Scott, Greg,<br /><br />You both bring up important points. Your topics actually open up some interesting technical details and nuances that aren’t generally written about in books and articles on the topic and therefore that many photographers are not aware of.<br /><br />Scott,<br /><br />The 2-stop method that many of us read about and used for years goes back to film days. It was used for subjects like snow scenes, where you meter off the snow and open up two stops. Or white wedding dresses. This method worked because:<br /><br />1. Many photographers wanted to avoid Zone 9 back in film days. Most were not exposure masters like Ansel Adams or David Ziser and thus wanted to avoid risking their highlights blocking up. Also, most did not shoot in carefully controlled conditions the way a fine art photographer like Adams would. Many or most working photographers shoot weddings, events or photojournalism, where exposure is much harder to control consistently. <br /><br />So most photography books/articles historically advised readers to target Zones 7 and 8 for whites and avoid Zones 9 and 10. Digital gives us more leeway (within certain bounds) especially shooting RAW. So now we can target Zone 9 with more confidence like David does.<br /><br />2. If you meter off of diffused whites or snow, your meter actually will often not give you *exactly* middle gray. <br /><br />Saying it does is a simplification to make instruction easier. In actual practice Zone 5, or“middle gray”, is really a *range* of tones, not just the one specific tone known as 18% gray. The 10-step Zone gray scale Ansel Adams developed was a very useful simplification of the real world, which is actually a continuous gradient, not a small number of 10 discrete steps. <br /><br />Just think of an S-curve in Photoshop or a film response curve from film days, that’s actually how tones work in real life. If you divide either curve into 10 zones, the left edge of each zone will be noticeably darker than the right edge of the same zone. <br /><br />That is why settings like 1/2-stop, 1/3-stop or even 1/10-stop make sense. Otherwise all of those readings would give us exactly the same exposure until we ‘officially’ crossed a hard zone boundary.<br /><br />When we meter off of snow or a diffused white wedding dress, the middle gray we get will actually be brighter than an exact middle gray by 1/2 stop or so, maybe more. Add to that another 2 stops over and we’re actually 2-3 stops over, which puts us in Zones ‘high 7 to low 8’, pretty close to the Zone 9 that David targets. The reverse is true for metering off of a grooms’ black jacket, we’ll tend to get a little darker ‘middle gray’ than we will metering off of a white wedding dress.<br /><br />Metering off of your palm has almost exactly the same effect as David’s Zone 9 method. The difference in human palm tones is typically within 1 stop and tends to be a bit toward the brighter side within Zone 6. The meter will try to set that to the brighter side within Zone 5. So by opening up one stop from that reading, your diffuse highlights should end up somewhere in the brighter side within Zone 8 or somewhere in Zone 9.Robert Ashhttp://www.robertash.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17534827.post-51365199539994075532010-05-06T08:17:20.022-04:002010-05-06T08:17:20.022-04:00Hi Nilesh,
The focal length does not matter, alth...Hi Nilesh,<br /><br />The focal length does not matter, although with the human palm method you need to fill the frame with your palm. <br /><br />If your lens is too wide-angle to fill the frame with your palm, you can switch to a longer lens for a second, take the reading off your palm, open up a stop, then use exactly the same exposure reading with your wide-angle. Happy shooting!Robert Ashhttp://www.robertash.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17534827.post-21920995832116861492010-05-06T00:40:25.861-04:002010-05-06T00:40:25.861-04:00Hi
wanted to know will these meeter reading will w...Hi<br />wanted to know will these meeter reading will work any focal or does not matter????<br /><br />Thanx NileshAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17534827.post-12308016949722858062010-05-05T15:31:50.789-04:002010-05-05T15:31:50.789-04:00The only problem with this method (underexposing) ...The only problem with this method (underexposing) is that you will loose 1/2 of the possible data in a given digital image. If you camera has an 11 stop dynamic range the brightest stop holds the most data, 1/2 of the possible info for the entire photo. See this chart, about 1/3 of the way down the page.<br /><br />http://www.normankoren.com/digital_tonality.htmlGregnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17534827.post-62141696988678575212010-05-05T15:05:14.127-04:002010-05-05T15:05:14.127-04:00Hi Scott,
I'm NOT metering off the dress the w...Hi Scott,<br />I'm NOT metering off the dress the way Robert is. I'm simply making my exposure based on my lighting, ISOs, etc. Then I'm determining IF the exposoure is correct based on my histogram read. I make the minor adjustments as necessary so that the dress falls into Zone 9. <br /><br />Yes, I could do what Robert is doing by taking a reading off the white dress and then increase the exposure by 4 stops. That would put the dress in Zone 9 too. I'm just modifying my exposure based on the histogram to be sure the dress is in Zone 9.<br /><br />Hope that clears any confusion.<br /><br />-DavidDavid Ziserhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02674227631785266632noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-17534827.post-72906505953543829652010-05-05T13:29:30.783-04:002010-05-05T13:29:30.783-04:00Hi David,
You have me, and youve lost me both at ...Hi David,<br /><br />You have me, and youve lost me both at the same time. Let me try and explain. After reading about Robert and using his palm and looking at your zone diagram I get it. 1 zone 1 stop. Then if youre using a diffuse white to meter off the camera will want to see that as medium gray. Fine, so looking again at your zone diagram you have to push that tone up into zone 9. So counting that up thats four zones or 4 stops. But what I have always used was two stops. What am I missing here...something doesnt add up.<br /><br />Regards,<br />Scott<br /><a href="http://www.luzunlimited.com" rel="nofollow">www.luzunlimited.com</a>Scott Vineyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06015941701387469450noreply@blogger.com